Re: The Case Against Casey Anthony - March 2011

by lisette Mon Mar 07, 2011 8:39 pm

Caylee Anthony case: Magpie reports on 03/07/11 hearing
Posted on March 7, 2011 by Valhall
It was a full house again for the hearing. George and Cindy (especially George) looked like they’ve had enough for awhile. Cindy is usually somewhat physically affectionate, putting her arm on George’s back, etc. I never see any reciprocal behavior from George. I realize, too, that some are more public than others, but this is a couple who knows they are in the public eye and being scrutinized at every movement – just saying. This has got to be an emotional roller coaster that they wish they could just get off. Cindy still looks for any acknowledgment from Casey, which again didn’t happen, but George has stopped. I noticed each day that he has looked at this feet or the back of the room when court was clearing instead of trying to make eye contact.

By the way, the couple previously identified as George’s parents are not. They go to the Anthony’s church.

It was surprising to see all the detectives in court again today since their testimony wasn’t needed. I respect their ability to sit there seemingly unaffected while their reputations are besmirched. I guess they’ve had enough trial experience to know to expect it. But it still would require great self control. In Mason’s argument for Miranda he kept talking about intimidation. Have you every been innocent and felt intimidated or fearful of a cop?

Today seemed different all around in court. I don’t know what it was, but if it’s burnout, how will we last through an extended trial? The usual cast of media were there. Most of them are engrossed in their Blackberry or Iphone. I, too, was busy boppin’ and weaving trying to look for little expressions or tells of the people there. LOL.

Baez seemed very deflated today; in court and outside. Typically he is smiling and polite. He typical kind of watches who’s watching. Today he had a different demeanor. While waiting for the elevator after the hearing another reporter asked Mason a question and then a few more. After getting out Baez made a comment about “If you let them ask one it turns into 5″. Funny he seemed to love the media earlier. I also noticed that Casey seems to be turning to Mason a lot more for her questions and scribblings. Could the tide be turning?

The defense and prosecution seemed more adversarial again today. I guess you can’t call the other side names and still expect to share cookies and milk afterward.

So what was the stipulation all about that Baez met in August 2008 with law enforcement and Linda Drane-Burdick? Is that something we’ve heard before and I missed or forgot?

Is Mason purposefully misleading the court or does he need to brush up on the testimony? He’s combining the arrest (for minutes) with the trip that Acevedo took with Casey to Sawgrass. She was not ‘arrested’ when Acevedo patted Casey down. That is typical procedure when allowing anyone into you police car. Suspect or not, there are procedures for everyone’s safety. George was once again vehemently shaking his head in agreement with Mason when he said that you “Can’t unarrest someone”.

I was also a little stunned by Mason once again talking about poor little Casey being intimidated by all these big men. He also pointed out, several times, that she had no prior experience with law enforcement and therefore could be easily confused. Well, isn’t it a point, also, that George has been a law enforcement officer? If he and Cindy had any concerns about Casey’s safety or impending arrest wouldn’t he have stepped in?

Linda Burdick would be a great poker player. She does make comments to her fellow State attorneys, but never really shows emotion. Poor Mr. Ashton, I don’t know if he realizes how often he does it, but when someone makes a comment he disagrees with, he shakes his head “NO”.

I haven’t watched any video yet, but right after Judge Perry made his reference to Mason about a “Parks” case, Joy Wray walked in. I need to rewatch it because it seemed like the Judge was very interested in her arrival. Maybe it was just that she came in late to the proceeding, but something in the gallery seemed to catch Judge Perry’s attention for quite awhile.

Sorry, not much to give for today with such a short hearing and all.

Peace

…Magpie.

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by lisette Mon Mar 07, 2011 9:23 pm

Regarding Robyn Adams and Sylvia Hernandez: CM stated today before he began his final argument that they had "separated" these two from this particular motion because they hadn't been able to depose them yet.

by lisette Mon Mar 07, 2011 9:24 pm

Casey Anthony Back in Court at Hearing Over her Words
Updated: Monday, 07 Mar 2011, 7:31 PM EST
Published : Monday, 07 Mar 2011, 7:31 PM EST

By Keith Landry
FOX 35 News
Orlando, Fla. (WOFL FOX 35) - Casey Anthony was back in court Monday, wearing a lavender turtle neck with her hair pulled back. She took notes during much of the hearing. Prosecutors and defense attorneys argued over statements Casey made to detectives and deputies early in the case. They argued over whether those statements should be allowed at her murder trial.

Defense attorney Cheney Mason says, The statements from the very first, with Lee and with her parents, and then with her and the recordings, violated her sixth amendment right to counsel.

Mason insists detectives tried to use Casey Anthonys family against her, urging them to gather information from Casey while they visited her at jail. Mason says detectives knew they could not get information out of Casey because she already hired attorney Jose Baez.

Mason implied law enforcement tried to make a deal with the Casey family. She's got a lawyer, and we can't talk to her but you can with a nod and a wink.

Mason argued many statements from Casey and her family should not be used at the trial because the state denied her right to have legal counsel.

Prosecutors say Anthony's family was set on finding little Caylee Anthony and they are working on their own to get any information they could out of Casey.

Prosecutors laid out their argument in court. That they were acting independent of law enforcement and with no active encouragement from them. As such, they cannot be deemed to be agents of law enforcement.

The defense also argued detectives did not read Anthony her Miranda Rights before talking to her, trying to get any information out of her they could.

Prosecutors argued Caseys first conversations with detectives happened before she was a suspect in the case, so that was all legal.

Judge Belvin Perry says he will rule late next week on the two issues he heard arguments on today in court.

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by Guest Mon Mar 07, 2011 9:40 pm

ORLANDO, Fla. -- The following is text from a jailhouse call made by Casey Anthony to her mother ,Cindy, and brother, Lee:

"Casey?" Cindy Anthony said to begin the call.

"Mom," Casey Anthony said. "I just saw your nice little cameo on TV."

"Which one," Cindy Anthony said.

"What do you mean, which one?" Casey Anthony said.

"Which one?" Cindy Anthony said. "I did four different ones, and I haven't seen them all. I've only seen one or two so far."

"You don't know what my involvement is in (inaudible)?" Casey Anthony asked.

"Casey," Cindy Anthony said.

"Mom," Casey Anthony said.

"No, I don't know what your involvement is, sweetheart," Cindy Anthony said. "You are not telling me where she's at."

"Because I don't (expletive) know where she's at," Casey Anthony said. "You are kidding me?"

"Casey, don't waste your call screaming and hollering at me," Cindy Anthony said.

"Waste my call sitting in the jail?" Casey Anthony said.

"Whose fault is it you're sitting in jail?" Cindy Anthony said. "Are you blaming me you are sitting in the jail? Blame yourself for telling lies. What do you mean it is not your fault? What do you mean it's not your fault, sweetheart? If you would have told them the truth and not lied about everything…"

"Do me a favor and just tell me what Tony's number is," Casey Anthony said. "I don't want to talk to you. Forget it."

"I don't have his number," Cindy Anthony said.

"Well, get it from Lee," Casey Anthony said. "I know Lee is at the house. I saw Mallory's car was out front. It was just on the news. They were just live outside the house."

"I know they were," Cindy Anthony said.

"Well?" Casey Anthony said.

"Can you get Tony's number for me so I can call him?" Casey Anthony said.

"Hello?" Casey's brother Lee said.

"Hi," Casey Anthony said. "Can you get me Tony's number?"

"I can do that but I don't know what good it's going to do you at this point," Lee Anthony said.

"Well, I'd like to talk to him any way because I called to talk to my mother and it is a (expletive) waste," Casey Anthony said. "By the way, I don't want any of you coming up here when I have my first hearing for bond and everything. I mean don't even (expletive) waste your time coming up here."

"You know, you are having a real tough year and making it real tough for anybody to want to try to, even if it is giving..." Lee Anthony said.

"See that is just it, every..." Casey Anthony said.

"You are not even letting me finish," Lee Anthony said.

"Go ahead," Casey Anthony said.

"First, you are asking me for Tony's phone number so you can call him and then you immediately want to start pressing toward me and don't even worry about coming up here for all this stuff and trying to cut us out," Lee Anthony said.

"I'm not trying to cut anybody out," Casey Anthony said.

"I'm not going around and around with you," Lee Anthony said. "You know, that is pretty pointless. I'm not going to put everyone else through the same stuff that you've been putting the police and everybody else for the last 24 hours and the stuff you've been putting mom through for the last four or five weeks. I'm done with that. So, you can tell me what's going on. Kristina would love to talk to you because she thinks you will tell her what's going on. Frankly, we are going to find out, whatever is going on is going to be found out. So, why not do it now?"

"There is nothing to find out," Casey Anthony said. "There is absolutely nothing to find out. Not even what I told the detectives. I have no clue where Caylee is. If I knew where Caylee was, do you think that any of this would be happening? No."

"Anyway, you only have a couple of minutes with this so I'm not going to let you completely waste it," Lee Anthony said. "Here is Kristina."

"No, no," Casey Anthony said. "I want Tony's number. I'm not talking to anybody else."

"Hello," Kristina said.

"Hi," Casey Anthony said. "I'm glad everybody is at my house but I'll have to call you later or I'll have to call to get somebody to get your number. Do me a favor and get my brother back because I need Tony's number."

"OK," Kristina said. "Is there anything I can do for you?"

"I'm sitting in jail," Casey Anthony said. "There is nothing anybody can do now."

"I'm just trying to be a…" Kristina said.

"I know you are, honey," Casey Anthony said. "I absolutely know you are and I appreciate it and everything you are trying to do but I'd like to call Tony. He's not at my house is he?

"No," Kristina said. "It's just me and your parents and Lee."

"Well, can you do me a favor and get my brother back so I can get the number from him please?" Casey Anthony said.

"Does Tony have anything to do with Caylee?" Kristina asks.

"No," Casey Anthony said. "Nothing."

"OK, so why do you want to talk with Tony?" Kristina asks. "You probably don't want to tell me, do you?"

"Tony had nothing to do with Caylee," Casey Anthony said.

"Oh, then why do you want to talk with him?" Kristina asks.

"Because he is my boyfriend and I want to actually try and sit and talk to him because I didn't get a chance to talk to him earlier," Casey Anthony said. "Because I got arrested on a (expletive) whim today and because they are blaming me for stuff that I would never do. That I didn't do."

"Well, I'm on your side, you know that?" Kristina said.

"I know that, I just want to talk with Tony and get a little bit of…" Casey Anthony said.

"Casey, you have to tell me if you know anything about Caylee," Kristina said. "If anything happened to Caylee, I'll die -- you understand, I'll die."

"Oh my God," Casey Anthony said. "Calling you guys (was) a waste -- a huge waste. Honey, I love you. You know I'd never let anything happen to my daughter. If I knew where she was, this would not be going on."

"Then how come everyone is saying that you are lying?" Kristina said.

"Because nobody is (expletive) listening to anything that I'm saying," Casey Anthony said. "The media misconstrued everything that I said. The (expletive) detectives pulled (expletive) (expletive). They got all of their information from me but at the same time they are twisting stuff. They already said they are going to pin this on me if they don't find Caylee. They've already said that. They arrested me because they said..."

"They said that the person you left Caylee with doesn't exist," Kristina said.

"Because, oh look, they can't find her in the Florida database," Casey Anthony said. "She is not just from Florida. If they would actually listen to anything that I would have said to them, they would have had their leads. They maybe could have tracked her down. They have not listened to a (expletive) thing that I've said."

"You know that whoever has Caylee, nobody is going to get away with it," Kristina said.

"I know, nobody is going to get away with it but at the same time, the only way they are going to find Caylee is if they actually listen to what I'm saying and I'm trying to help them and they are not letting me help them."

"So, how can I help them find her?" Kristina said. "The best thing you can do baby is to listen to me."

"They need to look up her information in the New York database and a North Carolina database," Casey Anthony said. "And other places that she's lived outside of Florida. That is what I told them, even again today. I told them that four times today. I sat up at the police station. The county police station…"

"Does she have Caylee or did she transfer Caylee to someone else?" Kristina asked.

"Honey, I have not talked with her," Casey Anthony said. "I don't know. I have not talked to her."

"How come everyone is saying that you are not upset and that you are not crying and you show no caring of where Caylee is at all" Kristina asked.

"Because I'm not here (expletive) crying every two seconds because I have to stay composed to talk to detectives, to make other phone calls and do other things," Casey Anthony said. "I can't sit here and be crying every two seconds like I want to -- I can't."

"OK, Casey, don't yell at me, I'm on your side," Kristina said.

"I know you are on my side," Casey Anthony said. I'm not trying to... "

"Nobody is saying anything bad about you," Kristina said. "Your family is with you 100 percent."

"No they're not," Casey Anthony said. "That is (expletive) because I just watched the (expletive) news and heard everything that my mom said. Nobody in my own family is on my side."

"Yes they are," Kristina said.

"They just want Caylee back. That is all they are worried about right now is getting Caylee back," Casey Anthony said. "And you know what, that is all I care about right now."

"Casey, your daughter, your flesh and blood and baby girl.." Kristina said.

"Kristina, please," Casey Anthony said. "Put my brother back on the phone, I don't want to get into this with you right now. I love you honey and I'm glad that you are there. Thank you for your help. I will let you know if there is anything that you can do."

"You can't tell me anybody who can find Caylee?" Kristina asked.

"No," Casey Anthony said. "No because everyone that I've tried and every number that I've called is disconnected --nothing. I can't get a hold of anybody."

"But that girl was the last person to have her?" Kristina said.

"She was the last person to have her," Casey Anthony said. "That was the last time I saw Caylee."

"Lee said he doesn't have Tony's phone number," Kristina said.

"Yes, he does," Casey Anthony said. "He has Tony's number in his phone. He needs to stop (expletive) lying. He just told me a second ago that he'd give me the number."

"So, if I go and get you Tony's number, are you going to finish talking to me?" Kristina said.

"I will call you tomorrow," Casey Anthony said. "I want to talk to him really quick. I wanted to actually try and call Mike. I haven't slept in four days. I have not slept in four days.

"Listen, if you are going to talk to anybody, you can talk to me," Kristina said.

"I know I can talk to you but at the same time, I know that I can talk to Tony and that is who I want to talk to now. I have not gotten the chance to talk to him since this morning. Since all of this stuff happened with trying to set up the MySpace and I made the MySpace,"

"Do you know the password?' Kristina asked.

"I made all of it," Casey Anthony said.

"What's the password to MySpace so we can see if anybody has written any leads of where Caylee might be," Kristina asked.

"You can go online and see it," Casey Anthony said. "As far as messages, I don't know if anybody is going to be messaging."

Casey Anthony then exchanged log-in information with Kristina.

Kristina then gave Casey Anthony Tony's phone number.

"Can Tony tell me anything?" Kristina asked.

"Baby, Tony doesn't know anything, Casey Anthony said. "And, I have not even talked with him since this morning."

"Has Tony seen Caylee?" Kristina asked.

"Tony has not seen Caylee since the beginning of June," Casey Anthony said. "What's Tony's number again?"

Kristina gives the number again.

"Thank you," Casey Anthony said. "I will find a way to call you later. Leave your number at my house with my mother and I can get it either later tonight."

"How can I get a hold of you?" Kristina said.

"I'm at the jail, you can't," Casey Anthony said.

"You don't have a way to write my phone number down?" Kristina said.

"No, I have no way of writing it down," Casey Anthony said. "I have to remember Tony's number. I have to try to memorize his number right now. Just leave your number with my mom and I will try to call you in the morning if I don't get a chance to call you tonight."

"So, how can I find information about that girl?" Kristina asked.

"Have them look up a New York license for Zenaida Fernandez-Gonzalez," Casey Anthony said. "They've just been looking up the last name Gonzalez or the last name Fernandez. If they look up her entire name, they might actually find her. They have not done that. They haven't listened to anything that I've said."

"How do you spell Zenaida," Kristina said.

"Z-e-n-a-i-d-a," Casey Anthony said.

"Where does she live?" Kristina said. "Because they went and looked at her place and…"

"Baby, you are not telling me anything that I don't already know," Casey Anthony said. "Again, I've only been in jail since about 8:30 tonight. I was with them all day. I know that. I was with officers pretty much since 9 p.m. last night up until this evening when I came up here."

"But you are telling the whole truth and nothing but the truth?" Kristina asked.

"That I have no clue where my daughter is?" Casey Anthony said. "Yes, that is the truth. That is the absolute truth."

"They'll find out and whoever…" Kristina said.

"OK, Kristina, I'm hanging up," Casey Anthony said. "I've need to make this other call before I forget the number. So, I'll call you later."

"OK," Kristina said. "Bye."

In the two areas I put in bold.
Number 1 LA and KC are talking about how KC is trying to cut them out. I believe this is where some of the anger GA and CA feel towards Baez because he took control and charge of KC not them.
Number two KC talks to her friend on this recording about how she got arrested on a whim. I don't see why it took 2.5 days of hearing for the Judge to decide on throwing out evidence like this tape recorded phone converation.

by cherylz Tue Mar 08, 2011 5:57 am

I just saw that 53 sec. clip that Jeanne posted above. She is all dressed up in her tight fitting turtle-neck, strutting in to court. She sits whispers and smiles to Baez, all the while fluttering her eye-lashes. Stops to regain her composure and then starts the primping ritual. The fact that she has been in prison for over 2 years now is not showing on her. The heartache of the past years does show on CA and GA. They have aged so much. And GA's face always looks "distressed".

by jeanne1807 Tue Mar 08, 2011 6:10 am

I found this video of Joy Wray. Thought somebody might be interested. Is this the gal that did a turnaround or is she still sticking to her story.

I actually don't remember much about her. That is why I went googling and found this video.

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by jeanne1807 Tue Mar 08, 2011 6:27 am

I went back for another look at the Joy Wray video and then read the article. Who is his Rose Speaks. She seems to be favoring Casey as the victim in all of this.

by artgal16 Tue Mar 08, 2011 9:31 am

Zenaida Fernandez Gonzalez - The Judge has to go by the police report in my opinion. Anyone can say anything they want afterward, but the report is documented. The report clearly states that the "suspect" is ZFG not Casey Anthony. She was never arrested for murder. She was arrested for child abuse. Her five minutes of handcuffing falls under detaining a suspect and the procedure to have her sit in a police car handcuffed is also protection for the officer. By their own testimony the Anthonys stated their actions were to find Casey regardless if the police helped them or not, so they actually stated in so many words they were not working for the state. I dont think any of the defense's motions will be granted.
The fact that they took her to Universal where she stated she worked and questioned her is only because she lied about where she worked. They might have been suspicious but they couldnt possibly have known that Casey killed her child. Casey stated there was a nanny and as far as I know the other Anthonys didnt
contradict that to the police. The police had suspicions
but they arent stupid enought to arrest her without
any basis - it could have been a boyfriend who was Caylees father, for all they knew who took her. There were too many possibilities in the LE minds at that point to really know anything except the child was missing and Casey was lying to them.

by lisette Tue Mar 08, 2011 10:42 am

You're so right, Artgal...Knowing what we know now, we have to make an effort to go back and put ourselves in the place of LE and what they were thinking at the time. By other things that KC had said that night, they could be thinking that she is hiding Caylee from her parents and is lying to cover up where she is.

by jeanne1807 Tue Mar 08, 2011 10:50 am

I am kind of on the defense side in all of this. I think once they put those cuffs on her..they needed to mirandize her. That was her right as a citizen.

Hate Casey all we want but our system gives everybody certain rights.

As the defense said you can't unarrest somebody.

If I was to be arrested, put in handcuffs and placed in a police cruiser cage...I need to be read my rights.

I think they messed up and I think Baez will appeal as soon as the words come out of Judge Perry's mouth if he gives the prosecution the verdict on this one.

They really have enough without this to convict her. This was certainly not her only lie and not her only mention of Zeniada.

Sometimes you have to give a little to get a lot.

I have complete faith in Judge Perry. He seems to know the law backwards and forward. But no matter what this is not the end of Casey and Baez and their drama.

I don't know how I shall manage three months of this horse and pony show.

by lisette Tue Mar 08, 2011 10:55 am

Casey Anthony: Could she hold her own or was she victim of conspiracy?

posted by halboedeker on March, 7 2011 6:32 PM

Day 4 in the Casey Anthony hearings, and the attorneys supplied the drama.

They have styles that echo pop culture. Defense attorney Cheney Mason is the showboating good old boy; it’s as if Big Daddy from “Cat on a Hot Tin Roof” had decided to practice law. Don’t you expect him to say mendacity?

Prosecutor Linda Drane Burdick has a determined, precise style — think Glenn Close in “Jagged Edge.”

WESH-Channel 2’s Bob Kealing set the scene: “We heard prosecutors invoke the name of Zenaida Gonzalez. Meanwhile, the defense did claim conspiracy and said detectives in the case targeted Casey as a suspect early on.”

Television replayed dramatic highlights from the fourth day in hearings about whether crucial statements will make it into the trial. Anthony is charged with first-degree murder in the death of her daughter, Caylee.

Mason said that 110-pound Anthony was surrounded by “four big guys” – two in front and two in back — as she gave them a tour of Universal Studios. (She said she worked there, but she didn’t.)

Drane Burdick scoffed at the notion of “little Casey Anthony,” adding, “She could hold her own, and she did.”

Mason also said that detectives “with a nod and wink” used Anthony’s family to conspire against her. Burdick countered that Anthony’s family was working independently to find Caylee above all and couldn’t be considered agents of law enforcement.

WKMG-Channel 6’s Tony Pipitone offered analysis: “The law appears to be much more on the state’s side.”

The defense argued that Anthony wasn’t read her Miranda rights, but prosecutors countered that she wasn’t considered a suspect early in the case. WFTV-Channel’s Kathi Belich noted that Anthony had given 26 statements freely early in the case.

What would it take to get Anthony’s statements tossed from the trial? The Miranda rights have to be given when a person is in “custodial interrogation,” Pipitone explained. “To determine that the judge has to look at the purpose, place and manner of questioning,” Pipitone added. “It’s up to the judge to determine if a reasonable person — not necessarily Casey Anthony — but a reasonable person would believe under those circumstances that they were in custody.”

Drane Burdick said the focus early in the case was on the baby-sitter that Anthony said was named Zenaida Fernandez-Gonazalez and had the toddler.

But Belich added, “Casey didn’t even need a nanny nor could she afford one because she lied about having a job.”

WFTV legal analyst Bill Sheaffer said it was critical for the defense to get Anthony’s statements out. “The state will show that she consistently lied, lied, lied, and that demeanor is the antithesis of the demeanor of a woman whose child has gone missing,” he said.

The stations supplied details about what unfolded in the court. Kealing observed that Anthony squeezed Mason’s shoulder. “That seemed to take him by surprise. He didn’t realize she was coming in,” Kealing said. “At the end of today’s hearing, Casey did not appear to acknowledge her parents, who were in the courtroom all afternoon. Judge Perry says it will likely be toward the end of next week before he makes a ruling.”

Kealing later added more detail: “We saw George Anthony in the audience shaking his head with disgust from time to time [at] the state’s statements and arguments he didn’t agree with.”

On WOFL-Channel 35, Keith Landry also highlighted that Perry’s rulings will be coming next week. Landry described the atmosphere as “spirited” and noted that Anthony wore a lavender turtleneck with her hair pulled back.

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by artgal16 Tue Mar 08, 2011 11:07 am

She was handcuffed for just a few minutes. I dont think the handcuffing is the main challenge, I think the point is that the conference room conversations that were recorded and her statements at that time
is when the defense feels she should have been Mirandized. But the Miranda law has changed I have to look it up - there was a recent change by the Supremes and it favored LE. Any police officer will tell you that they can handcuff someone to detain them, calm them down etc without arresting them.

by artgal16 Tue Mar 08, 2011 11:16 am

What I just read on several websites dealing with legalities is that you can be detained without being arrested and handcuffed. Also that Miranda only comes into play if you are unable to leave of your own free will. Therefore the fact that they made a big deal about the door at Universal's conference room not being locked and Casey not in handcuffs and actually went willingly to Universal with them are circumstances that do not call for Miranda. After all
they were probably very surprised she lied to them
about working there as she actually accompanied them right up into the building. Who lies so brazenly
and about something immediately shown to be a lie?

by ctee1 Tue Mar 08, 2011 12:39 pm

Her words could be thrown away, but she will still get the death penalty. How can mommy not report her baby. Actions speak louder than words. The jailhouse tapes show it all. not a care on the world for Caylee. Just for Tony. If Judge Belvin throws them out, can the defense make an appeal? Will the trial date change?

by artgal16 Tue Mar 08, 2011 12:47 pm

Regardless of what stays in or goes - its doubtful she will get the death penalty IMO. She is too young
they wont vote for death.

by lisette Tue Mar 08, 2011 1:32 pm

Art, I also doubt that she will get the death penalty...With an "undetermined cause of homicide" from Dr. G., I think the jury will take the life in prison route. As for me, I'd rather have death penalty than spend the rest of my life in prison. But KC will probably be OK with it...free room and board, not having to lie about having a job, reading, sleeping, listening to music, writing letters to admirers, ignoring the other Ants...But maybe, if she's put in general population, she will get her "just desserts"...

by Guest Tue Mar 08, 2011 1:52 pm

lisette said As for me, I'd rather have death penalty than spend the rest of my life in prison

That makes 2 of us.

by artgal16 Tue Mar 08, 2011 3:03 pm

She might not get life without parole either - but in Florida I think you have to do at least 75 percent of your sentence. If she gets 30 years thats a long time to spend-
she will be old when she gets out. Cindy and George have Lee and Mallory they will have other grandchildren - god help them!

by jeanne1807 Tue Mar 08, 2011 4:05 pm

Taken from above.

"What would it take to get Anthony’s statements tossed from the trial? The Miranda rights have to be given when a person is in “custodial interrogation,” Pipitone explained. “To determine that the judge has to look at the purpose, place and manner of questioning,” Pipitone added. “It’s up to the judge to determine if a reasonable person — not necessarily Casey Anthony — but a reasonable person would believe under those circumstances that they were in custody.”

Again. If I was handcuffed and placed in a cage backseat of a police car by a policeman. Then I think I should know my rights via Miranda.

In my mind I am under arrest.

A private citizen has no idea how this arrest business works. I am sure at some time she asked "am I under arrest"? I wonder when and what the answer was.

by artgal16 Tue Mar 08, 2011 4:12 pm

But when she was placed in the car handcuffed she was not questioned and released a few minutes later.
I think that would be considered detained for a time
but not in custody. But again, just my thoughts on this.

by HippieChick Tue Mar 08, 2011 4:27 pm

Detained is not the same as being under arrest.
People are detained all the time for questioning, in the station house in an interview room, and they are not under arrest. Remember Casey in her video where she was in a room at police station being questioned, all the primping, tucking, smoothing, etc she did when nobody was in the room?
She wasn't under arrest then either. She didn't "act" too concerned.
Her main worry was her appearance, not if she was under arrest JMO.

Defense is trying to pull anything they can out of their hat. Casey was not afraid of the "big bad men" and she is most certainly NOT a child.

HippieChick

by lisette Tue Mar 08, 2011 6:45 pm

HippieChick wrote: Casey was not afraid of the "big bad men" and she is most certainly NOT a child.

I about choked on my coffee when CM referred to KC as "a child". And I agree with LDB that she was more than able to "hold her own" with the detectives. She was combative and sarcastic, probably due to years of practice defending her lies to Cindy.

by artgal16 Tue Mar 08, 2011 7:27 pm

Yes thats my story and Im sticking to it!

by lisette Tue Mar 08, 2011 8:09 pm

I was thinking about Mark Hawkins. During the recent hearings, Baez mentioned something about him wearing a wire for the FBI when he visited the Ants and came to his (Baez's) office. LDB cut him off really quickly with an objection. I didn't even know that he came in from California. It is very strange that his statement has not been released in discovery...There must be a reason for that. I remember that KC has been in contact with him during the 31 days and told him that she had something to tell him that her Mom and Lee already knew. Speculation was that he was Caylee's father. (He and KC had dated at one time.) I do see a resemblance in their photos. Anyway, the prosecution is keeping whatever he told them close to the vest as far as the public is concerned.
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by artgal16 Tue Mar 08, 2011 8:19 pm

I never heard that before! Wow, to actually know Caylees father that would be something.

by lisette Tue Mar 08, 2011 8:23 pm

Correct me if I'm wrong, someone, but I don't think Lee's girlfriend, Mallory Parker's, transcript was ever released either. Wonder what she said that the State didn't want "out there"...

by artgal16 Tue Mar 08, 2011 8:28 pm

Lets hope what she said wasnt too unflattering
to Casey - because the Anthonys are soon going to be her in-laws!

by lisette Tue Mar 08, 2011 8:57 pm

Mark Hawkins and Mallory Parker are both on the State's Witness List, but that doesn't necessarily mean that they'll be called. Below is a link to the official, up-to-date list. It's kinda interesting to refresh memory about who these people are...Also amazed by the number! This trial will last months! C'mon KC, 'fess up and stop being SUCH a WASTE!

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by jeanne1807 Tue Mar 08, 2011 9:00 pm

HippieChick wrote:Detained is not the same as being under arrest.
People are detained all the time for questioning, in the station house in an interview room, and they are not under arrest. Remember Casey in her video where she was in a room at police station being questioned, all the primping, tucking, smoothing, etc she did when nobody was in the room?
She wasn't under arrest then either. She didn't "act" too concerned.
Her main worry was her appearance, not if she was under arrest JMO.

Defense is trying to pull anything they can out of their hat. Casey was not afraid of the "big bad men" and she is most certainly NOT a child.

HippieChick

They are detained and they are called in for questioning but they aren't handcuffed and placed in a cage police car by a police officer.

Sorry but I believe she was arrested and should have been read her rights.

I agree with Mason. You can't "unarrest" a person.

I believe the state will win this one but in my mind...Casey's rights were violated.

And believe me I give a baby killer very little slack. I do believe she killed Caylee and partied for that month and is a bad person..nada nada nada. But on this point, I think they were wrong.

by jeanne1807 Tue Mar 08, 2011 9:19 pm

Of Interest to our discussion.

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by artgal16 Tue Mar 08, 2011 10:14 pm

changes to Miranda:
SALT LAKE CITY, Utah (ABC 4 News) - Criminal suspects have a right to remain silent but they'll need to speak up. There's now a change to the Miranda rights.

The decision by the Supreme Court was a close one, 5-4. It expands the limits of the Miranda rights that have been around for decades. While some of the Supreme Court justices say this isn't ground-breaking and only makes sense, others on the Court think otherwise.

This change to the famous Miranda rights now means criminal suspects will have to break their silence and tell police they want to exercise their right to silent to stop any further questioning, just like they would speak up to ask for a lawyer If a suspect does not make it clear they want their right to remain silent officers may continue to question them.

Defense attorney Greg Skordas says, “This case seems to imply that once you've read the Miranda warning and then the person proceeds to talk you can infer that they have waived their Miranda rights and they understand those Miranda rights.”

For Justice Sonya Sotomayor, deciding to make suspects speak to have the right to remain silent was a step too far. She is the court's newest member, and wrote a strongly worded dissent for the court's liberals, saying the majority's decision "turns Miranda upside down."

This is the third time this session that the Supreme Court has placed limits on Miranda rights. There is now a time limit on a request for a lawyer. Also, police do not have to explicitly tell suspects they have a right to a lawyer during an interrogation.

What's potentially confusing for suspects is when they’re read their Miranda rights, they’re told anything you say can and will be used against you in the court of law. Now they’ll have to go against that and speak to say they don't want to talk.

source:
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by artgal16 Tue Mar 08, 2011 10:26 pm

The article by Andrea was very interesting and very informative. I have never heard of Danny Rollings so I looked him up it was a terrible case.

by jeanne1807 Tue Mar 08, 2011 10:38 pm

I think the Miranda Rights have become just too confusing to everybody. Even the Supreme Court is split..5 4.

So if the Supreme Court is confused can you imagine the policeman just trying to do his duty.

Then the attorney trying to get the guilty man/woman off.

A simple tool that has become way too complicated for everybody.

In my opinion it is tying up way too much of the courts time.

by ctee1 Wed Mar 09, 2011 10:45 am

Looking like the defense will win on the home and universal interrogations and Not the jailhouse videos...Casey will still be found guilty.

What if the defense wins?

Can the state appeal?

Could the trial be held off?

by artgal16 Wed Mar 09, 2011 10:57 am

Ctee I respectfully disagree - after reading the post above that Jeanne posted by andreadreamin from wordpress I dont see the case law supporting the defense's arguments and I also dont think an appeal would be successful. A person that is arrested would be searched and her cell phone for sure would have been confiscated. None of that was done. There was
a simple pat down before she was placed in the police car and handcuffed but the officer at that time had in his mind a theft as that was what Cindy initially called about and she was released from the handcuffs and was free to go back into her home and make calls
or get on the computer if she had wanted to. That isnt a description of a person who felt they were in custody.

by ctee1 Wed Mar 09, 2011 11:10 am

Ya I see your point ..What if the defense does wins? Cant the state appeal the ruling?

If so, can this trial be pushed ahead?

by artgal16 Wed Mar 09, 2011 11:23 am

I dont think this will affect the date of the trial and
no the state wont appeal it. If the defense wins on some of the motions it just means those statements that Casey made cannot be used. I believe the State
has enough without them to convict her. The defense's only strategy is to get thrown out as much as possible
but they still dont have a credible reason why the mother of a two year old wouldnt report her missing
for 31 days and go out and party. I dont care how much scientific evidence there is, a jury will not be able to get past that - Caylee is dead and someone is to blame - juries are about assigning blame.

by ctee1 Wed Mar 09, 2011 11:49 am

Do you think that she will ever come out of protective custody? Could there be some protection for her after they find her guilty? Does anyone know if she could get special consideration? Her father told Ms Drane B that he fears for her in general population. He knows she is goin down..

by cherylz Wed Mar 09, 2011 11:54 am

See...I think that KC with her craving for attention personality will THRIVE in general pop. She will be the "leader" in a clique. She will adapt quite well to her surroundings. Look at how her family, lawyers, some fellow prisoners, even some guards give her special attention and favor.

by artgal16 Wed Mar 09, 2011 11:57 am

I agree Casey will do ok in general population - they will not isolate her once she goes to prison. She will be in there with the rest of her ilk.

by Guest Wed Mar 09, 2011 12:33 pm

I hope KC falls on her face in the general population. I have heard even the most harden criminals don't like baby killers.

by artgal16 Wed Mar 09, 2011 12:35 pm

Frankly, I think that is overblown as far as what goes on there with inmates, at least for the women.

by Guest Wed Mar 09, 2011 12:55 pm

In this case I hope what I heard is correct. KC living in hell is exactly what she deserves.

by charminglane Wed Mar 09, 2011 2:17 pm

Think of all the women in prison that have kids at home that they miss. Sure, they made horrible mistakes in life to end up in prison, however, most probably did nothing to their own children.
She will have it rough. Because she is evil. And they know it.

by jeanne1807 Wed Mar 09, 2011 2:29 pm

cherylz wrote:See...I think that KC with her craving for attention personality will THRIVE in general pop. She will be the "leader" in a clique. She will adapt quite well to her surroundings. Look at how her family, lawyers, some fellow prisoners, even some guards give her special attention and favor.

I agree and have said the same thing upthread. I have always thought Casey needed parameters that were never given to her. She needed to be loved and guided and educated.

I believe she will do quite well.

With all of that said she killed her daughter and one can never see past that when they look at Casey no matter what she becomes. She did the evilest of deeds.

Her attire in court just shows me what Casey has always thought important. Showing off for the guys.

Her family should have gotten her past that and showed her that "pretty is as pretty does".

by artgal16 Wed Mar 09, 2011 2:34 pm

There is an element in sociopathic women of sexual abuse. Her attitude about men was a vehicle to remove herself from her mothers grip, but also
she went from man to man as a means of living off of them and progressing onward and upward for her own
means and desires. We never know what a sociopath thinks but its basically to continue to do what they want to do without having to work for it.
There is no doubt she doesnt love anyone because no matter how mad a young person, and I count her as one, is mad at parents they love -they would never turn away from them as she has in court. Its another one of her petty tyrannies and manipulations.

by jeanne1807 Wed Mar 09, 2011 2:41 pm

Artgirl I am not going to bring your post down but how right you are.

They continue to give her undying support with no consequences for her actions and she continues to turn away from them to maintain the control. I wonder how a jury will see all of that?

Perhaps as we do. A very disfunctional family.

I have often wondered what would happen if..sorry to say..she did walk free.

Can you imagine them all going back to that life together in that home.

Makes my head spin.

by artgal16 Wed Mar 09, 2011 2:59 pm

If she were free, I dont see that she would have a choice - in my opinion to get away from people they would have to send her out of the state or move themselves but they cant move as I dont believe they have any equity in that house

by jeanne1807 Wed Mar 09, 2011 3:06 pm

I believe the Anthonys have something on the back burner for when this is all over. A book deal or a movie deal. They have something. I can feel it.

I am pretty sure they are both on disability right now. Haven't read it anywhere but under the "circumstances" that would be my bet.

by artgal16 Wed Mar 09, 2011 3:10 pm

I know Cindy was on disability - but I got the impression George might be working. They have a lot of friends through their church - maybe someone gave him a job.

by lisette Wed Mar 09, 2011 3:42 pm

I know that it was mentioned somewhere that George had quit coming to the hearings because he was working...But that could have been just speculation. I wish some interested local could find out what was going on with them and report on it...

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